Pension - HL 199 (2)

On Feb 8, 2014 11:51 AM, "Mike Ward" <orcaspilot@gmail.com> wrote:

Mark,

I read with great interest that TWA pilots just won a victory over ALPA as it was shown that ALPA did not equally represent the interest of all the pilots.

So.....do you think that decision impacts us at all?  Do we need to sue ALPA?

Those pilots who were still on the seniority list in late 2005 were made whole by the company (defined contribution plans) in exchange for voting to terminate the contractual retirement obligations.

So, again in very general terms, there were only a few of us that retired in 2005-2006 that had 50% of our earned retirement taken.

That does NOT sound like equal representation by ALPA to me.

In addition, I seem to remember that in very late 2005, we got a letter from ALPA saying that they would no longer represent retired pilots.  Which in itself was a violation of the contract.

I'm a little surprised that DP3 has not taken up the issue. Bottom line, I expected more at the end of the day from the union that I paid into for 20 years.

Just wondering

regards

Mike ward

Editor: Good questions.  Let’s take them one at a time.  There are over 3500 delta pilot retirees severely impacted by delta's actions.  And sometimes we get thinking that we were either the worst hurt or one of the few.   The truth is that the company’s actions hurt a large number of families.  Now concerning ALPA. Mike you made mention that you had “paid” dues to them for over 20 years.  The operative word is paid……past tense.  It has been my experience that ALPA attempts to represent those who are “paying” dues, and by the way, representation in varying degrees.  For us retirees who no longer pay dues it would appear that we have become less than important.  In any case if you are like me, you certainly consider actions taken on our behalf by the union and inaction since our retirement that they are no longer representatives for any aspect of our lives.  I go as far as to say, from ALPA we got bad information before retirement and since retiring we have seen no help, therefore the modern day phrase applies, “they are dead to me.”

About the TWA “win”.  TWA pilots were suing for an unreal amount of money approaching 1 Billion dollars.  They “won” $50 million which ALPA will pay out of loose change in the treasury.  This is not a win!  As far as TWA pilots are concerned it is a total joke.  Interestingly enough, the impetus for DPA gained some traction because there was a thought that ALPA would become liable for this big TWA debt and assessments would be out the window.   Since the quasi victory by ALPA, it is likely that DPA will suffer a loss of steam. 

About suing ALPA.  Dp3 has looked into legal action against both ALPA or the company and decided against it.  I will not speak for them as their reasons were well thought out and debated.  There perspective it much more informed than mine anyway and they overwhelming chose to go after the PBGC, so I won’t presume to know which course was best.   Quite honestly, while a suit against ALPA may be very satisfying to file, I think it unlikely to happen or win with success. However, all that said, our inequitable pension treatment and the injustice of our lost benefits issue is not dead yet.  Dp3 is still leading the charge in preparing legal action that would restore some of the claimants qualified monies.  In addition,  the effort led by Rob Moser is in a little lull but has not died either in its attempt at restoration of non-qualified benefits.   It has been a long time and many just wish to forget it and move on with their lives.  But I would just say that since there has been this huge injustice and unfair treatment, that it is worthwhile to stay engaged. 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Note: This post is from a comment on the HL Blog and Emile does not have a reply email address.  If you wish to reply simply reply to the PCN and we will post. 

From: Emile Trash

Date: 02/06/14 12:46:13

To: misc@pilotcommunication.net

Subject: [PCN High Life] New comment on Mark's Remarks - HL 198 (4).

I was one of the retirees that was a dues paying DP3 member in good standing that was ejected from DP3 because I was classified by PBGC as PC4. As a group, we PC4 retirees retained our own council at great expense and challenged the decision by DP3 to take actions that would have terminated my pension. I believe that type of hypocracy by DP3 leadership should be known by other members. This is exactly the type of divisive actions by the usual DALPA suspects that make me regret ever paying dues to that organization.

Editor: Emile I can’t speak for the DP3 though I support them.  It seems to me that blaming the Dp3 for what the company did is like blaming basketball for not going in the hoop.  I sympathize with any pilot hurt by company actions during bankruptcy.  It is very difficult for anyone representing our interests now to “win” back benefits to the satisfaction of all.  If there is any blame for you to throw around I would think ALPA would be at the top of your list.  PC4 guys should have been better counseled.  Further, it is my understanding (correct me if I am wrong) according to ERISA precedent PC4 category are in a hierarchy of recipients and should only get dollar one after all PC3 category guys have received maximum benefits.

 


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Full post disclaimer in left column. PCN Home Page is located at: http://pcn.homestead.com/home01.html