From: Ron Little
Date: 12/9/2012 7:09:12 PM
Subject: Calif.
AG sues DAL
Interesting !
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From: Michael Lloyd
Date: 12/4/2012 10:32:03 AM
Subject: US
Airways Pilots First to Investigate PBGC-Trusteed Pension - Forbes
Hi Mark,
Just saw this
article and thought I would pass it along.
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Petition Posts:
Mark,
Have not read the petition. Don't need to. It will be summarily rejected.
I will not grovel at the feet of the corrupt individuals at Delta (including the bankruptcy court judge - who, I presume, has a nice vacation villa in the Caribbean...courtesy of Delta Air Lines...at the expense of retired Delta pilots). Those corrupt individuals include the Board of Directors and all "management" pukes under their control...from then 'till now.
Their positon will not change...no matter how much damage they deliberately and intentionally created.
And no matter how many pleas from the kids who thought their dads were Captain America.
We did our part. We flew jets all over the world.
What they did is not right. It will not be reversed.
Get over it.
Move on.
Have not read the petition. Don't need to. It will be summarily rejected.
I will not grovel at the feet of the corrupt individuals at Delta (including the bankruptcy court judge - who, I presume, has a nice vacation villa in the Caribbean...courtesy of Delta Air Lines...at the expense of retired Delta pilots). Those corrupt individuals include the Board of Directors and all "management" pukes under their control...from then 'till now.
Their positon will not change...no matter how much damage they deliberately and intentionally created.
And no matter how many pleas from the kids who thought their dads were Captain America.
We did our part. We flew jets all over the world.
What they did is not right. It will not be reversed.
Get over it.
Move on.
Jim Armstrong - Parts Unknown yohobubba@yahoo.com
Editor: Jim’s
sentiments are shared by some within our group and believe it or not I
understand. A collective voice CAN have
an impact. Heck, if that weren’t so our
republic wouldn’t be here today. I know the wheels of justice sometimes grind
to a halt or move very slowly, but the UsAir retired pilots may reach some
success in their appeal with the PBGC. I am more encouraged by our own DP3’s
efforts reaching some success. And Rob’s
efforts are worth supporting. I want of
course for his goal of gaining a meeting to occur. But I see supporting of his efforts as the
right thing to do for the right reasons.
And for that right reason, I won’t “get over it.”
++++
Mark,
I too was and still bothered by the inflight announcements. Tempted many times to respond.
This petition is a reasoned piece of writing and frankly better than any effort I might have made. I have no idea of the cost of what I now propose but I strongly believe that the public which is largely ignorant of the "business" tactic of strategic bankruptcy should read this because any employee of a large US corporation is at similar risk. Even government pensions at the local, state, and federal level are in danger because retirement legislation drafted by a lobbyist failed to protect anyone but corporations and banks.
I believe this petition should be published as a full page advertisement in the WSJ,New York Time, USA Today, Aviation Week & Space Technology, Atlanta Journal, and other significant local newspapers. If anyone is knowledgeable about uploading to social media we should saturate all venues. Will this make a difference? Perhaps not! What it will do is call out Delta Senior management and their use of one of the most blatant lies ever perpetuated in public relations.
You published my recollection of personal conversations with Mr. Garrett. People who know me know that over 30 years I had my differences with Delta Policies and two extremely hard fought grievances illustrate this. However, there was never a question of mutual respect between employees and management and in particular between employees. As pilots we took pride in the level of professional maintenance our aircraft enjoyed that allowed us to do our job safely and the capital expended on first class training that is now dispersed through out the world and keeps other airlines safely flying by virtue of Delta's bankruptcy. Ironic is it not?
I have few assets left but would gladly contribute what I can to set the record straight. Perhaps the officers of DP3 could coordinate this effort. Apparently this might conflict with constant caveat to not disperse info about our pending court case. My belief is let's call a spade a spade. The truth is the truth. Our ranks seem to shrink weekly and I suspect accelerated by nearly 10 years of daily stress brought on by the actions of senior management past and present.
We should have 5,000 signatures to this petition perhaps even 50,000 rather than 500. I was skeptical of the effort originally but all I can say now is "Well Done."
I too was and still bothered by the inflight announcements. Tempted many times to respond.
This petition is a reasoned piece of writing and frankly better than any effort I might have made. I have no idea of the cost of what I now propose but I strongly believe that the public which is largely ignorant of the "business" tactic of strategic bankruptcy should read this because any employee of a large US corporation is at similar risk. Even government pensions at the local, state, and federal level are in danger because retirement legislation drafted by a lobbyist failed to protect anyone but corporations and banks.
I believe this petition should be published as a full page advertisement in the WSJ,New York Time, USA Today, Aviation Week & Space Technology, Atlanta Journal, and other significant local newspapers. If anyone is knowledgeable about uploading to social media we should saturate all venues. Will this make a difference? Perhaps not! What it will do is call out Delta Senior management and their use of one of the most blatant lies ever perpetuated in public relations.
You published my recollection of personal conversations with Mr. Garrett. People who know me know that over 30 years I had my differences with Delta Policies and two extremely hard fought grievances illustrate this. However, there was never a question of mutual respect between employees and management and in particular between employees. As pilots we took pride in the level of professional maintenance our aircraft enjoyed that allowed us to do our job safely and the capital expended on first class training that is now dispersed through out the world and keeps other airlines safely flying by virtue of Delta's bankruptcy. Ironic is it not?
I have few assets left but would gladly contribute what I can to set the record straight. Perhaps the officers of DP3 could coordinate this effort. Apparently this might conflict with constant caveat to not disperse info about our pending court case. My belief is let's call a spade a spade. The truth is the truth. Our ranks seem to shrink weekly and I suspect accelerated by nearly 10 years of daily stress brought on by the actions of senior management past and present.
We should have 5,000 signatures to this petition perhaps even 50,000 rather than 500. I was skeptical of the effort originally but all I can say now is "Well Done."
R.C.
(Rick) Bauer
Captain 767ER Retired 09/2003 Capt767er@aol.com
Captain 767ER Retired 09/2003 Capt767er@aol.com
++++
Good
Luck Robert,
I loved the theme and tone of your remarks, but corporate Delta needs a
more substantial push to right the wrong of pension thievery. Release an
in-depth interview on the subject through a local ATL TV station. I'm sure
there is a zealous, young reporter who would eat this up! Release Robert's
letter for publication in the media. (Radio, news outlets, internet web
sites, TV etc.) Betcha that Delta doesn't reply to your request for a meeting
in 30 days.
Press releases are the only method of threat to corporate Delta.
Good Luck, and Happy Holiday Season,
Pat McGirl
Capt. MD-11 ret. (1996 at 29% of my pension)
I loved the theme and tone of your remarks, but corporate Delta needs a
more substantial push to right the wrong of pension thievery. Release an
in-depth interview on the subject through a local ATL TV station. I'm sure
there is a zealous, young reporter who would eat this up! Release Robert's
letter for publication in the media. (Radio, news outlets, internet web
sites, TV etc.) Betcha that Delta doesn't reply to your request for a meeting
in 30 days.
Press releases are the only method of threat to corporate Delta.
Good Luck, and Happy Holiday Season,
Pat McGirl
Capt. MD-11 ret. (1996 at 29% of my pension)
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IGNITE Travel Proposals:
I just want to correct an erroneous
allegation made by Mr.Kight. He maintains in his letter, that "...active
employees and their immediate pass riders should continue to have priority
boarding over retirees at all times, as has always been the case at
Delta." That is not a correct statement. At one time, in the sixties and
before the NE merger, retirees and active duty employees were treated in the
same manner in terms of boarding. In fact, retires were treated as favored senior
statesman, having made the airline what it was to that point. Further, one had
to work for the company for ten years in order to be able to earn an annual
pass, as it was then called.
My daughter, who works for United, because of the then in effect nepotism policy at Delta, relates that UAL retirees keep their hire date for pass boarding priority, as a just reward for their years of service.
Best, Harry Ballance (Dept 031 retired) hgballance@yahoo.com
My daughter, who works for United, because of the then in effect nepotism policy at Delta, relates that UAL retirees keep their hire date for pass boarding priority, as a just reward for their years of service.
Best, Harry Ballance (Dept 031 retired) hgballance@yahoo.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Mark,
Please add my comments and forward all of them to Richard Anderson richard.anderson@delta.com and Rob Kight robert.l.kight@delta.com
My Comments:
I am opposed to the pass policy changes proposed by the IGNITE team for retirees.
The Project: IGNITE team recommends that we provide retirees with an allotment of six (6) priority passes that would allow them to be on the standby list ahead of other retirees and unaccompanied parents/non-dependents. Currently, all retirees travel using the S3B priority code along with unaccompanied parents and non-dependents. This new policy will not displace active employees or their immediate family, but would give retirees the ability to travel ahead of unaccompanied non-dependents, parents and other retirees traveling on the normal S3B priority code.
As you know, the present S-3B boarding priority includes retirees, parents of active employees and non-dependent children of active employees. In a separate recommendation from Project Ignite, employees who are on personal leave of absence will be moved from S-4 to S-3B. All four of these groups are prioritized based on the date of hire so retirees are usually at the top of the S-3B grouping.
The Project Ignite recommendation will allow retirees to select a new boarding priority within the S-3B group, that of "S-3 Day of Departure". Retirees who select the new boarding priority will be on a separate list with other retirees who have also selected the new check in time boarding priority. These retirees will be boarded ahead of other retirees and the other groups.
Finally, the change will allow persons who have a computer to check in early.
Retirees will be the only group of Delta employees that will have to compete for a seat based on a new pass policy that boards by time of check-in – not seniority. After a retiree has used all the “special” passes he/her will be placed on the bottom of the list below all the S-3 retires pass holders that have not used their passes for the rest of the year. I am opposed to this radical change in Delta pass policy.
Ron Stowe
Please add my comments and forward all of them to Richard Anderson richard.anderson@delta.com and Rob Kight robert.l.kight@delta.com
My Comments:
I am opposed to the pass policy changes proposed by the IGNITE team for retirees.
The Project: IGNITE team recommends that we provide retirees with an allotment of six (6) priority passes that would allow them to be on the standby list ahead of other retirees and unaccompanied parents/non-dependents. Currently, all retirees travel using the S3B priority code along with unaccompanied parents and non-dependents. This new policy will not displace active employees or their immediate family, but would give retirees the ability to travel ahead of unaccompanied non-dependents, parents and other retirees traveling on the normal S3B priority code.
As you know, the present S-3B boarding priority includes retirees, parents of active employees and non-dependent children of active employees. In a separate recommendation from Project Ignite, employees who are on personal leave of absence will be moved from S-4 to S-3B. All four of these groups are prioritized based on the date of hire so retirees are usually at the top of the S-3B grouping.
The Project Ignite recommendation will allow retirees to select a new boarding priority within the S-3B group, that of "S-3 Day of Departure". Retirees who select the new boarding priority will be on a separate list with other retirees who have also selected the new check in time boarding priority. These retirees will be boarded ahead of other retirees and the other groups.
Finally, the change will allow persons who have a computer to check in early.
Retirees will be the only group of Delta employees that will have to compete for a seat based on a new pass policy that boards by time of check-in – not seniority. After a retiree has used all the “special” passes he/her will be placed on the bottom of the list below all the S-3 retires pass holders that have not used their passes for the rest of the year. I am opposed to this radical change in Delta pass policy.
Ron Stowe
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Hey. Mark:
We retired NWA Pilots have NOT lost our benefits! You DAL pilots could
have done the same as we did to preserve benefits back when ... but didn't!!
Jim Rhoades
We retired NWA Pilots have NOT lost our benefits! You DAL pilots could
have done the same as we did to preserve benefits back when ... but didn't!!
Jim Rhoades
Editor:
Before you are too hard on Jim, he did say he would support our petition. Some of the NWA pilots just don’t realize we
were “blindsided” by management and ALPA, and it could have well happened to
them. This isn’t us against the NW guys
now onboard or visa versa. This is us
against a wrong management committed against our group.
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